Additional pre-created queries for best scores server

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BryanFRitt
Posts: 219
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:16 pm

Additional pre-created queries for best scores server

Post by BryanFRitt »

Easy access to some more SQL style queries on the scores server would be nice...
  • levels that have been submitted but never been officially solved (maybe someone else solved it, but the tape didn't work out)
  • levels that haven't had any submissions (a fresh less played level)
  • levels that have been solved the most (good when wanting not to deal with unsolvable level)
  • unsolved levels where almost all levels in the levelset have been solved (for those that would like to have levelsets completed)
  • unsolved levels where almost all levels of it's levelset have been solved by a particular player (for those who want have their levelsets completed)
  • and maybe others ??? ...
It would be need to be able to have some kind of voting/polling system for levels that haven't been officially solved yet. (Edit: be able to query this too. For the goal of trying to have every level's solvability determined.)
Something like:
[ ] I currently believe this level is unsolvable
[ ] I currently believe it's possible that this level is solvable, but just can't/didn't do it
[ ] I currently believe this level is solvable, just haven't put in an officially working tape
[ ] I gave up on this level
[ ] not voting on this level / default (Edit: this line added)
...
Life is partially trying to strike a balance between generating new things/ideas, and making sure they are good/organized. These extremes can be said to between gibberish mess and nothing said/done.
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Holger
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Re: Additional pre-created queries for best scores server

Post by Holger »

I think both ideas (querying and voting, as described) are very good ideas that would be very helpful!

Regarding the voting system, this could even be implemented in R'n'D itself, in various ways. For example, I already thought about a quick and easy voting system that could be added just after a level was solved: Before or after telling the user that the tape was saved, there could be a "please give zero to five stars for this level" request, which could be helpful to use this information to flag recommended levels (and level sets). But you are right that it is probably even more interesting if a level was *not* solved, for various reasons (like "boring", "too hard", "apparently unsolvable" etc.), but I am not sure how this could be done in a way that wouldn't bother most users (like asking every time a level was aborted by pressing "Escape" or the "stop" button).

Regarding the queries to the high score server database you described, some of them could probably done directly using SQL queries, while others may have to be pre-calculated every night or something like that (those, that cannot directly done in SQL).

Another extension could be some sort of "expert mode" that could be enabled to not only see solved levels, but also all failed tape submissions (like unsolvable tapes, duplicate tapes etc.). Those are currently excluded from the "public" high score server...
BryanFRitt
Posts: 219
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:16 pm

Re: Additional pre-created queries for best scores server

Post by BryanFRitt »

Holger wrote: Mon Mar 21, 2022 5:38 pm Before or after telling the user that the tape was saved, there could be a "please give zero to five stars for this level" request
I am not sure how this could be done in a way that wouldn't bother most users (like asking every time a level was aborted by pressing "Escape" or the "stop" button).
Instead of automatically prompting when some event happens, there could be a keyboard shortcut that prompts for this. Press whatever the keyboard shortcut for this is, and get a prompt asking for a level rating.
How do you rate this level?
  • NO_RATING
  • -----
  • *----
  • **---
  • ***--
  • ****-
  • *****
Same could be done for the levelset rating.
Although... I suspect this rating system would probably be more of a distraction than helpful. A basic '*' rating could mean several different things to different people. How fun it was, How challenging it was, How well made it was, ... And having a setup that distinguishes these things might be too much.
while others may have to be pre-calculated every night or something like that (those, that cannot directly done in SQL)
Just curious as to what cannot directly [be] done in SQL would be.
Another extension could be some sort of "expert mode" that could be enabled to not only see solved levels, but also all failed tape submissions (like unsolvable tapes, duplicate tapes etc.). Those are currently excluded from the "public" high score server...
The level/levelset names could be color coded to distinguish between these, and color guide page(s) added to the 'INFO SCREEN'. Before picking colors, perhaps do a survey of what colors people would like to represent what, and why.
Life is partially trying to strike a balance between generating new things/ideas, and making sure they are good/organized. These extremes can be said to between gibberish mess and nothing said/done.
filbo
Posts: 647
Joined: Fri Jun 20, 2014 10:06 am

Re: Additional pre-created queries for best scores server

Post by filbo »

Prompting on completion would be annoying, of course...

Inside the game, where might you see a level (a) which you haven't completed; (b) which you have?

(a) (1) in the main menu, as the currently focused level of the current levelset
(a) (2) inside the game (in active play / pause / etc) upon retrying (or trying for the first time)
(b) (1) in the main menu, as the currently focused level of the current levelset (if you went backwards, or have turned off the 'go to next level when solved' setting, or returned 5 years later...)
(b) (2) inside the game (in active play / pause / etc) upon retrying for whatever reason

So OK, there are two places (1) and (2).

(1), main menu, can show a star rating (or whatever) of the focused level. Clicking that would show more details, whatever those might be -- playability level, enjoyability level, etc.; along with ample UI room to ask this player to add their input

(2), in game play, can also have a star rating widget; clicking it would pause the level and go to the same more detailed UI

In both cases, if the game knows that the player has tried the level and failed, it could offer additional input widgets about why they didn't -- too hard, not enough emeralds (or more generally 'exit conditions seem impossible to meet'), too boring, seems to require excessively precise timing, seems to be an uninteresting duplicate of another level, whatever.

Unclear whether such opinions ought to be conditioned on the player having failed. You don't know if they tried the same level (and failed) on another system. Or played it out, and in hindsight, do not recommend it to others because it's too boring.

Of course any such system of ratings could be 'gamed' by someone injecting lots of false BS. While this is probably unlikely to happen, someone could decide to grief the system and inject false claims about lots of levels. I don't think an automatic system to prevent this is necessary; however, it should be designed so that a flag can easily be set on a particular player account, which means 'completely ignore everything this account has ever said about any sort of review thing'. Then if a griefer comes along, you can just manually set that flag on their account(s).

Levelsets should also have the same kind of rating system. A sort of levelset rating could be derived from aggregate individual ratings, but that will fail to capture some of the 'too boring' sorts of opinions ('the whole levelset seemed to be a copy of another levelset with only the colors changed + the plagiarist's handle written in the borders'...)

Both individual level & levelset ratings could, maybe should, have an optional text field. Just one per node (player x level or levelset) -- not one per individual slider (enjoyability etc.). When looking at the detailed rating UI for a particular level / levelset, show the optional text fields in some way, e.g.:

ByranFRitt: clever use of one-way tubes and gravity
Filbo: boring, copy of levelset 'blah blah'

(first, prefiltering out comments which are essentially empty e.g. just a dot or whatever)
BryanFRitt
Posts: 219
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:16 pm

Re: Additional pre-created queries for best scores server

Post by BryanFRitt »

Both individual level & levelset ratings could, maybe should, have an optional text field.
The ability to add text reviews/comments to these would really help those that are trying to pick out a level/levelset to play. Although, this could be abused with ads, and there maybe people who might be offended by things said (curse words, insults, ...).
(first, prefiltering out comments which are essentially empty e.g. just a dot or whatever)
Some people might want to give it an alphabet style rating/grade with this. 'A', 'B', 'C', 'D', ...
Life is partially trying to strike a balance between generating new things/ideas, and making sure they are good/organized. These extremes can be said to between gibberish mess and nothing said/done.
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