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arno 1158 sinking-f5
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by
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Arno
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ARNO                              2019-10-17 19:38
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REVISION OF THE BOTTOM SECTION, SHOULD THIS TIME BE WITHOUT CREATOR-BIAS...! :-)

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SHREDDER                          2019-10-17 21:01
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THIS TIME NO FSCS :) I'LL TRY MY RUN AFTER 22 ;)

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ARNO                              2019-10-17 22:09
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PHEW... GREAT! ;-)  
  
AND... ANOTHER CRAZY CAVE IN PROGRESS, TO BE RELEASED TOMORROW! :-D

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SHREDDER                          2019-10-17 22:29
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THIS IS AWESOME!   
I WOULD LIKE TO HAVE SOME MORE IDEAS FOR NEW CAVES :) IM SEARCHING FOR INSPIRATION ;) LOOKIN FORWARD FOR THE NEW ONE FROM YOUR GARAGE ;)  
OK, NOW IT'S TIME TO SOLVE THIS CAVE! :D

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SHREDDER                          2019-10-17 22:48
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OK GOT IT :)

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SHREDDER                          2019-10-17 22:49
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MY RUN WITHOUT THE TOP GROWING WALL USAGE :)

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NESDORI                           2019-10-17 23:09
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shredder, HOW DID YOU FIND THE LAUNCH SO QUICKLY? I DID TRY FEW THINGS BUT NO SUCCESS. PROBABLY THE LAUNCH IS SO SIMPLE THAT I JUST OVERLOOKED IT :)

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SHREDDER                          2019-10-17 23:26
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nesdori, AS YOU PROBABLY KNOW, MOST FORMATIONS ARE BASED ON THE VORTEX. I DID FEW TRIES IN THE CKIT AND FOUND A RIGHT WAY: STARTED WITH VORTEX FROM 2 FFLIES AND TRY TO SET FREE THE 3 FFLIES FROM ABOVE.   
AFTER SOME TRIES THE FORMATION WAS SET CORRECTLY ;)

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SHREDDER                          2019-10-17 23:34
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OH, AND SETTING THE VORTEX RIGHT IS THE KEY. SOMETIMES WHEN THE RIGHT MOMENT IS MISSED, THE FORMATION WILL NOT BEGINS :(

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NESDORI                           2019-10-17 23:36
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YES, I TRIED THAT AND BOMBARDED A VORTEX WITH 3 OTHER FLIES BUT DIDN'T SUCCEED TO LAUNCH. IT ACTUALLY LOOKS LIKE THAT 5F GOING DOWN CAN BE ALSO CONSTRUCTED FROM 3F GOING RIGHT BOMBARDED WITH 2 FLIES BUT I'M NOT ENTIRELY SURE IF IT'S POSSIBLE. I GAVE UP TRYING IT BECAUSE I REALIZED IT'S MOST PROBABLY NOT THE INTENDED WAY.

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SHREDDER                          2019-10-17 23:50
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YOUR IDEA OF CREATING "ON THE FLY" FORMATION IS FANTASTIC! I'LL TRY TO FIGURE IT OUT IN THE CKIT. VERY INTERESTING! :)   
  
I THINK THAT YOU WERE CLOSE, BUT THE PROBLEM WAS IN THE MOMENT OF CREATING VORTEX. OR MAYBE WRONG PATH OF THE 3 FFLIES. UP-RIGHT FF IN THE VORTEX MUST HAVE ONE SPOT OF DIRT ON THE RIGHT SIDE NEXT TO 3 FFS. TOP PIECE OF DIRT HOLDING THE 3 FFS MUST BE REMOVED WHEN THE FLIES ARE GOING DOWN.

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NESDORI                           2019-10-17 23:57
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I TESTED BOTH TIMINGS FOR EACH 3-FLY PATH, THERE'S OF COURSE ONLY TWO TIMINGS TO TEST BECAUSE VORTEX ONLY HAS TWO PHASES. I THINK THE PROBLEM WAS DIRT, I PROBABLY MISSED PROPER DIRT FORMATION AROUND THE VORTEX ALTHOUGH I MIGHT HAVE TRIED CORRECT PATH FOR FLIES.

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SHREDDER                          2019-10-18 00:01
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THE RIGHT PATH OF THE 3 FFS IS TO APPROACH ON THE VORTEX'S UP-RIGHT CORNER, AND SLIDE ON TOP ON THE VORTEX, CREATING REQUIRED FORMATION :)

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SHREDDER                          2019-10-18 00:06
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OFCOURSE ONE SPOT OF DIRT BETWEEN VORTEX AND 3 FFS.

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ARNO                              2019-10-18 08:16
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THE LAUNCH-METHOD IN MY RUN IS INDEED VORTEX-BASED, BUT STILL A BIT UNUSUAL IN THE FOLLOWING WAY.  
  
FRIGHT-3/4/5 AND CRAWLING-F4 CAN ALL BE LAUNCHED BY SLIDING 1 OR MORE FIREFLIES ALONG THE VORTEX AT A CERTAIN SIDE. BUT THE TIMING W.R.T. THE VORTEX' 2 STAGES IS OPPOSITE BETWEEN THE FRIGHT-SET AND CRAWLING-F4.  
  
THE SINKING-F5 FORMATION IS BASICALLY CRAWLING-F4 PLUS AN ADDITIONAL FIREFLY, THE "SNEAKY SINGLE", WHICH BREAKS INTO THE VORTEX LIKE FRIGHT-3. IN OTHER WORDS, THIS FORMATION COMBINES THE TIMING OF THE FRIGHT-SET AND CRAWLING-F4. THAT'S WHY SLIDING 3 FFLIES ALONG THE VORTEX WON'T WORK.  
  
IN MY SOLUTION, THE 3 FFLIES ARE NOT SLIDING ALONG THE VORTEX, BUT RATHER MOVING THROUGH THE VORTEX. THEY APPROACH FROM THE RIGHT AND ENTER THE VORTEX AT THE TOP-RIGHT CORNER OF THE 2X2 SQUARE.  
  
shredder: BASED ON YOUR DESCRIPTION, I THINK YOU APPLY THE SAME APPROACH.  
  
I READ ABOUT THE IDEA TO LET TWO FORMATIONS COLLIDE TO FORM A BIGGER FORMATION. GREAT IDEA! I AM CURRENTLY TESTING ALL POSSIBLE WAYS TO LET A FORMATION CLASH WITH A SPINNING FLY (OR VORTEX). THIS GIVES SOME INTERESTING EFFECTS, LIKE EXTENDED FORMATIONS. MY NEW CAVE (RELEASED TONIGHT) WILL SHOWCASE SOME OF THESE FUNNY EFFECTS! :-)

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DUSTIN                            2019-10-18 09:41
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I WATCHED A SINKING F5 IN SLOW-MOTION AND ONE CAN CLEARLY SEE THE VORTEX THAT IS DISTURBED BY ONE FLY AT THE UPPER-RIGHT CORNER AND TWO FLIES AT THE LOWER-LEFT! AS BOTH HAPPENS SIMULTANEOUSELY, THE MOVING DIRECTION APPEARS /TO BE RIGHT {FRIGHT-3} + DOWN-LEFT {CRAWLING F4} = DOWN! I ONLY WONDER WHERE THE ADDITIONAL PHASE COMES FROM, AS SINKING F5 HAS 8 PHASES, ONE MORE THAN FRIGHT-3 OR CRAWLING F4.

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ARNO                              2019-10-18 10:15
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OUT OF THE 8 PHASES, ONLY 5 SHOW A FRIGHT-3 AND CRAWLING-F4 AROUND THE SAME VORTEX. WHEN THE "SNEAKY SINGLE" BREAKS IN AT THE TOP-RIGHT CORNER (LIKE FRIGHT-3) THE FLY THAT IS KICKED OUT AT THE LEFT DISTORTS THE "WALKING PAIR" OF FLIES THAT WOULD NORMALLY BREAK IN LIKE CRAWLING-F4. INSTEAD, THIS FLY FORMS A VORTEX WITH ONE WALKING PARTNERS, WHILE THE OTHER ONE TAKES OVER THE ROLE OF THE SNEAKY SINGLE. ALL THIS TAKES 3 ADDITIONAL FRAMES, WHICH MAKES 8 IN TOTAL.  
MORE DETAILS IN NEXT ARTICLE. :-)

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NESDORI                           2019-10-18 10:37
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GREAT ANALYSIS AND WORK AGAIN, arno! PETER LIEPA PROBABLY NEVER REALIZED WHAT AN INTERESTING WORLD HE CREATED. HE JUST TRIED TO KEEP THE SCANNING RULES SIMPLE SO THAT OLD COMPUTERS CAN SCAN A WHOLE CAVE FAST ENOUGH :) BUT SIMPLE RULES OFTEN RESULT IN MOST INTERESTING GAMES.. LIKE A GAME OF GO (A BOARD GAME)

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SHREDDER                          2019-10-18 11:11
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OK. I DID FEW TRIES IN CKIT. I CAN SEE THAT COLIDING F-3 WITH F&AMP;F CAN RESULT WITH F-4 OR C-4 SO FAR :)

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ARNO                              2019-10-18 21:09
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DEMO TOMORROW! :-)

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SHREDDER                          2019-10-18 23:19
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CAN'T WAIT! :D IF YOU ENCLOSED FFLIES WITH 3 GROWING WALLS, I SUSPECT A VERY PRECISE MOVE AVOIDING THE EXPLOSION FROM ONE FFLY :)   
I'VE CHOSEN EASIER SOLUTION WITH ONLY 2 WALLS :)

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ARNO                              2019-10-19 09:46
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FREE NOW! :-)  
  
I DIDN'T INTEND TO MAKE THE GROWING-WALL STEP REALLY TRICKY, BUT I'D LIKE TO SEE YOUR WAY WITH 2 WALLS! :-D

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SHREDDER                          2019-10-19 11:34
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OK NVM :D WHEN I START TRYING, JUST REMOVE TOO MUCH DIRT FOR USE 3 WALLS ;)

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ARNO                              2019-10-19 12:10
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OH, A LAUNCH-METHOD WITH SLIDING FLIES IS POSSIBLE! I THOUGHT THERE WAS A TIMING PROBLEM, BUT PERHAPS THIS SOLVES ITSELF DURING THE TRANSFORMATION. I'LL HAVE TO DIG IT OUT... THANKS! :-)

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SHREDDER                          2019-10-19 15:52
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YES, THATS EXACTLY WHAT I MEANT :)