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2020-05-07 21:53 Arno  
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title: Poly-Parasitic Palace  
  
- Remake of Root -  
  
There used to be tracks here, but they were replaced by a mirror!

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2020-05-08 09:29 Arno  
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reminds me of " Arno  540 remix 40" and  trischi 's insane run.  
  
here an all \\\ run would be insane too! i haven't succeeded yet, but i think it's possible... ;-D

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2020-05-08 15:20 nesdori  
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hmm.. sounds like a challenge! :D

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2020-05-08 16:18 dustin  
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me while testing this cave:  
"hmm, let's see... what about requiring 12, 15, 18, 21, 24d on l1-5? 24 is quite challenging to me..."  
- some days later -  
"ok, i found a good and logical strategy for 24d, so let's try for 28d, this looks way harder..."  
- some weeks later -  
"nice, i've got a strategy for 28d which works quite well. so let's raise the requirement to 12, 16, 20, 24, 28!"  
- few days before release -  
"let's check all caves again... a - nice. b - nice. c - nice. ...... i - nice. j - hmmmm, i haven't really tried for all 32d yet. it looks so crazy to release the ff stack at thr right, the ff won't stay together but spread out on the whole cave... looks insane..."  
- some tries without getting close to success later -  
"hm. it's really insane, but i'm almost certain it must be mathematically possible. ah, you know what? i'll require 28d for all sane boulder dashers out there and then i'll sit back and enjoy  nesdori 's 32d run on  krissz 's site! yes, that sounds great!"  
;d

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2020-05-09 02:26 nesdori  
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 dustin , nice and colorful explanation of your thought process :) currently i have a plan how to get all \ consisting of 3 main phases. i was able to complete phase 1 so two to go. at first i had a different plan but it backfired (well not totally but it wasn't as smooth as i expected so i decided to change my plan).

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2020-05-09 12:40 dustin  
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that sounds very interesting! i felt i was a little bit lazy with my few all-d tries, and i thought there might actually be a relatively simple plan to do it. but now after reading your comment, i'm certain that it is really a "level 6" task for absolute experts and now i'm pleased with myself requiring "only" 28d ;d  
  
hopefully your 3-phase plan works out - i'm curious! and i'm glad that i have challenged you! ;d

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2020-05-09 13:00 Arno  
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all \ is possible! i did a successful run in gdash, using the save-state feature. but i could not redo that run since i forgot the exact steps (except for the first).  
  
 nesdori  good luck! i hope you'll succeed, would be great! :-D

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2020-05-09 13:10 nesdori  
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 Arno , wow! i hope you can refresh your memory and redo it! :) my best attempt so far has been that i cleared the entire right side and left side apart from the left side stack but then i ran into trouble :)

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2020-05-09 13:22 nesdori  
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my current plan is:  
  
1: prepare the left side by middle ring jailing some of the flies  
2: clear the entire right side  
3: return to the left side and finish the outer ring and the stack  
  
1 and 2 have been successful but 3 only partially :)

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2020-05-09 15:40 Arno  
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my steps were as follows:  
1. dig dirt away from the top section.  
2. clear outer rings; first right, then left. (per ring 1 fly released: the right one not the left one)  
3. clear middle rings; right and left. (idem)  
4. clear centres; right and left. (idem)  
during 1-4 i followed the rules "always stay behind the last ffly" and "release the next fly as soon as the last fly has left that pathway". idea is that the flies stay close each other and won't fill up the maze as long as possible.  
  
5. clear stacks. i vagely remember first left then right.  
  
all success depends on the exact timing of each step.  
  
i will try again. your idea  nesdori  to jail some flies is a good one too, may try that as well.

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2020-05-09 16:13 dustin  
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 Arno , have you saved a gdash replay with your solution? ;d

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2020-05-09 16:39 Arno  
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yes, but it replays only until the first save-state i had set.

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2020-05-09 17:02 nesdori  
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 Arno , interesting method! however, i'm going to stick with my plan so that we'll hopefully get two different 32\ solutions :)  
  
 dustin , your intended 28\ method similar to  Arno 's?

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2020-05-09 17:54 dustin  
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 nesdori ,  Arno , my 28d strategy is quite different:  
1. clear all dirt that is possible without ff release.  
2. go to the right half and clear the outer ring, release the right ff.  
3. same with middle ring.  
4. same with centers.  
my general rule so far was "do everything as quickly as possible".  
now:  
5. wait for an opportunity to move to the left half. usually, 1-2 ff move from the left half to the right half until such an opportunity occurs.  
6. repeat steps 2-4 in the left half.if you took the very first opportunity on step 5, then no ff should disturb this.  
7. finally release the left ff stack, grab the jewels and exit.  
  
left behind: 4d from the right ff stack.  
  
i still need several tries for a success, because little errors cause big trouble! ;d  
  
your strategies sound deeper to me, though. and also, my strategy seems to be bad for 32d, because logically the right ff stack would have to be the first one to release, and this will cause utter chaos!

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2020-05-10 11:47 Arno  
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no 32\ run yet, sorry!  
  
but the demo shows my method to get some fflies waling close to each other. i applied that method in my succesful gdash run. with some different timing choices near the end i also got the right stack cleared and a free way back as well...

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2020-05-10 11:49 nesdori  
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 Arno , oh! i thought that you managed to do 32\ before wathing the demo and i was like "do you really remove the dirt on the bottom before getting the last stack?!" :D

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2020-05-10 12:07 Arno  
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well i hoped to avoid disappointment with my comment ;-) perhaps this run could be optimized further by timing some steps differently, or it might give you an idea, so i thought let's just share it! :-D

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2020-05-10 12:34 nesdori  
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 Arno , yes but i was too hasty to watch the demo before you made the comment :)  
  
i have been tuning my method but there's still problems in the last stage. i'm trying to do things smoothly and avoid total chaos.

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2020-05-10 21:38 Arno  
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omfg...! ! ! :-o :-D  
  
yess, all 32 \\\ ! ! !  
  
just a lucky shot using the strategy i showed before, but this time all chaos worked out in my advantage!  
  
now this guy has deserved a fresh cool heineken...  
  
\\\  
  
i will hide my solution for a while to keep the challenge.  
  
\\\  
  
still a little shocked... wooow, i'm definitely a sunday child.... or maybe a bit stubborn as well...? ;-D

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2020-05-10 21:47 nesdori  
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 Arno , wow! enjoy the heineken, you deserve it! :)  
  
i'm also very close.. hopefully another 32\ demo tonight :)

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2020-05-10 21:58 Arno  
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thx  nesdori ! good luck, would be great! then i'd expect two totally different solutions...! ;-D

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2020-05-10 23:30 nesdori  
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got it finally! :)  
  
if your solution also has left side middle ring jail and right side outer ring "semi-jail" then there's a slight possibility that our solutions are similar :D  
  
damn these flies are pain to control; i would have liked to have even more controlled solution but it's challenging :)

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2020-05-11 00:44 dustin  
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hossa! congrat and thx for playing to the two most famous bd artists of all time! ;d

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2020-05-11 07:57 Arno  
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wow  nesdori , congrat! :-D  
  
my run is free. i had huge luck at two points near the end:  
  
1. after clearing the right stack, the road to the left was free, without oncoming traffic.  
  
2. after releasing the left stack, there were 2 fflies leaving the middle ring, which would normally break the colonne, resuling in fflies turning back and kill rockford. but miraculously, at 3:35, a cave scanning phenomenon forced them to move with the colonne, which gave rockford time to pick up the last 4 diamonds and head to the exit.  
  
your way has probably more method, can't wait to see it! ;-D

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2020-05-11 10:49 nesdori  
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 Arno , your solution is nice! the ending is not that chaotic than i thought it would be after your comments :)  
  
my run also free. it's based on jails which are created by releasing both flies on some ring and then the last piece of dirt on that ring is removed when all previously released flies are either on the inner rings or on the jail ring going anti-clockwise behind rockford. when a jail is finished, the flies keep turning left and they aren't able to escape the jail ring. but - these jails are not jailbreak proof. depending on how crowded it is and what is the initial arrangement of flies they eventually figure out that forming a chain of two or more consecutive flies walking towards the upper left corner will cause a fly escape because when the chain turns downwards in the corner, the latter fly gets scanned first causing it to change direction and espace, sometimes bringing a foe with it. but jail breaks are not a problem. the idea of jails is to keep the most of flies jailed for the remaining of the run. the harmony of the left jail will be disrupted anyway when flies are released from the right side. however, it's also possible that approaching flies get also jailed instead of causing disruption and that's what actually happens with the two first relases from the right side of which timing is planned; the first one gets jailed upon entering the next one gets in the jail going to wrong direction but is nicely converted by well-timed a corner collision where two flies going to opposite direction continue to the same direction. Now that those two first right side flies are also jailed there are more time to act freely on the right side. further releases will disrupt the left jail but it's so crowded anyway that jail breaks would occur soon.  
  
The idea of a jail is also used on the right side. when the stack is released the outer ring is cleared forming a outer ring jail. because of the stack flies the jail is so crowded that escapes are now frequent but once again is doesn't matter; the jail keeps most of the flies in so that it's easy to do the finishing touches on the left side.  
  
i also had some luck with fly collisions. just before the right stack is released, there are two flies approaching from the inner ring. if they would be able to turn to the outer ring, rockford must evade them by completing the outer ring jail before releasing the stack which was not the plan and would have been troublesome ending. but a chain of flies approaching from the right side of the upper ring grabs them with them and rockford can freely run towards the stack and after that the rest of the cave is easy to complete without any panic :)

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2020-05-11 10:59 Arno  
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just fantastic! thx for your run and nice explanation! :-D